Talk:Secret Correspondence - Revision history

Gaeamil at 07:35, 21 March 2007

2007-03-21T07:35:09Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 07:35, 21 March 2007
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	:::Yeah, that is a bit of a drawback. The ShowHide extension might be better (if it works) at creating the UHS-style that I was trying to emulate. I'm a little nervous though of how the "hidden" text would appear without Javascript support. Another alternative is to just leave all the information visible with all the hints on the same page (like a FAQ). Since a Hints page would probably mainly have gameplay spoilers with little in the way of plotline spoilers, we could simply tell people that they peruse the page at their own risk. This would also be a good format in the interim until a final solution is decided upon. Any other thoughts? --[[User:Fyzixfighter\|Fyzixfighter]] 04:44, 20 March 2007 (CET)		:::Yeah, that is a bit of a drawback. The ShowHide extension might be better (if it works) at creating the UHS-style that I was trying to emulate. I'm a little nervous though of how the "hidden" text would appear without Javascript support. Another alternative is to just leave all the information visible with all the hints on the same page (like a FAQ). Since a Hints page would probably mainly have gameplay spoilers with little in the way of plotline spoilers, we could simply tell people that they peruse the page at their own risk. This would also be a good format in the interim until a final solution is decided upon. Any other thoughts? --[[User:Fyzixfighter\|Fyzixfighter]] 04:44, 20 March 2007 (CET)

			I'm thinking that this page is just rather silly. It ought to just be used from the QuasiSpace page. If someone's found QuasiSpace, they've likely foud Falayalaralfali, so they know it's QuasiSpace already, and if they want this table, they can look there. And what exactly does Secret Correspondence mean?

Fyzixfighter: another two cents - hey, I'm just a poor grad student, it's all I can afford

2007-03-20T03:44:29Z

another two cents - hey, I'm just a poor grad student, it's all I can afford

← Older revision		Revision as of 03:44, 20 March 2007
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	::I agree with FyzixFighter. Additionally, I could install [http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/ShowHide_Extension this extension] to Mediawiki. It requires Javascript, which is a bad thing in general, but when no Javascript support is available, the result is only that the "hidden" text is shown. The alternative of having separate pages for individual hints has its own drawback, namely having to load a new page at each hint. — [[User:Svdb\|SvdB]] 03:42, 20 March 2007 (CET)		::I agree with FyzixFighter. Additionally, I could install [http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/ShowHide_Extension this extension] to Mediawiki. It requires Javascript, which is a bad thing in general, but when no Javascript support is available, the result is only that the "hidden" text is shown. The alternative of having separate pages for individual hints has its own drawback, namely having to load a new page at each hint. — [[User:Svdb\|SvdB]] 03:42, 20 March 2007 (CET)

			:::Yeah, that is a bit of a drawback. The ShowHide extension might be better (if it works) at creating the UHS-style that I was trying to emulate. I'm a little nervous though of how the "hidden" text would appear without Javascript support. Another alternative is to just leave all the information visible with all the hints on the same page (like a FAQ). Since a Hints page would probably mainly have gameplay spoilers with little in the way of plotline spoilers, we could simply tell people that they peruse the page at their own risk. This would also be a good format in the interim until a final solution is decided upon. Any other thoughts? --[[User:Fyzixfighter\|Fyzixfighter]] 04:44, 20 March 2007 (CET)

Svdb: reply

2007-03-20T02:42:37Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 02:42, 20 March 2007
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	:Well, since this is a community effort, I would like to give it some time to hear from others before making such a change. I'd also like to hear what you yourself think of such a compromise - is it a fair compromise? does it still provide the information that you want to include, and does it functionally do what you want for the people who want semi-spoilers? Is there a way to improve it? what are the downsides in your view? I would like it to be a compromise in the true sense of the word, rather than us old-timer editors making unilateral decisions against new editors (or visa versa). I think I'll wait a day to see if others chime in and also to give you a time to give your thoughts on it. --[[User:Fyzixfighter\|Fyzixfighter]] 18:45, 19 March 2007 (CET)		:Well, since this is a community effort, I would like to give it some time to hear from others before making such a change. I'd also like to hear what you yourself think of such a compromise - is it a fair compromise? does it still provide the information that you want to include, and does it functionally do what you want for the people who want semi-spoilers? Is there a way to improve it? what are the downsides in your view? I would like it to be a compromise in the true sense of the word, rather than us old-timer editors making unilateral decisions against new editors (or visa versa). I think I'll wait a day to see if others chime in and also to give you a time to give your thoughts on it. --[[User:Fyzixfighter\|Fyzixfighter]] 18:45, 19 March 2007 (CET)

			::I agree with FyzixFighter. Additionally, I could install [http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/ShowHide_Extension this extension] to Mediawiki. It requires Javascript, which is a bad thing in general, but when no Javascript support is available, the result is only that the "hidden" text is shown. The alternative of having separate pages for individual hints has its own drawback, namely having to load a new page at each hint. — [[User:Svdb\|SvdB]] 03:42, 20 March 2007 (CET)

Fyzixfighter: reply

2007-03-19T17:45:34Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:45, 19 March 2007
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	Well then, proceed with the deletion. [[User:86.35.40.204\|86.35.40.204]] 17:47, 19 March 2007 (CET)		Well then, proceed with the deletion. [[User:86.35.40.204\|86.35.40.204]] 17:47, 19 March 2007 (CET)

			:Well, since this is a community effort, I would like to give it some time to hear from others before making such a change. I'd also like to hear what you yourself think of such a compromise - is it a fair compromise? does it still provide the information that you want to include, and does it functionally do what you want for the people who want semi-spoilers? Is there a way to improve it? what are the downsides in your view? I would like it to be a compromise in the true sense of the word, rather than us old-timer editors making unilateral decisions against new editors (or visa versa). I think I'll wait a day to see if others chime in and also to give you a time to give your thoughts on it. --[[User:Fyzixfighter\|Fyzixfighter]] 18:45, 19 March 2007 (CET)

86.35.40.204 at 16:47, 19 March 2007

2007-03-19T16:47:25Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:47, 19 March 2007
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	::::In my view, the non-Spoiler hints page isn't for lazy players, but for first-time players. I have little to no respect for lazy people, and I hate having to compromise to satisfy the lowest common denominator. It's like putting "Warning: Hot" on coffee you buy at McDonald's or microwave instructions for pop-tarts that are longer than one step. Laziness should not be encouraged. I mean, how hard is it to get a piece of paper and pencil and write down 16 numbers. However, imho, the best compromise so far that still allows this information to be accessed while maintaining the integrity of the Non-Spoiler Hints page is a [[Hints]] page, with a disclaimer at the top that warns people that the information here spoils some aspects of the gameplay without spoiling major plot points, yada yada yada yada, or something like that. Such a page would also be excellent for the infamous "I can't get the Mycons to go to Organon" problem as well as contain the hints from the RPRG. Additionally, the hints can be hidden like a UHS using [[Hints/hint1]] to contain the hints so that a lazy person who only wants specific information won't accidentally see information that his lazy eyes don't want to see. A blurb can then be included on the non-spoiler hints page directing people to the '''Hints''', of course with a slight warning. Imho, this is a much eleganter solution than putting the verbose and overly complicated warnings and the annoying extra spaces and markings used right now, which are more appropriate to forum threads and not wiki articles. --[[User:Fyzixfighter\|Fyzixfighter]] 16:28, 19 March 2007 (CET)		::::In my view, the non-Spoiler hints page isn't for lazy players, but for first-time players. I have little to no respect for lazy people, and I hate having to compromise to satisfy the lowest common denominator. It's like putting "Warning: Hot" on coffee you buy at McDonald's or microwave instructions for pop-tarts that are longer than one step. Laziness should not be encouraged. I mean, how hard is it to get a piece of paper and pencil and write down 16 numbers. However, imho, the best compromise so far that still allows this information to be accessed while maintaining the integrity of the Non-Spoiler Hints page is a [[Hints]] page, with a disclaimer at the top that warns people that the information here spoils some aspects of the gameplay without spoiling major plot points, yada yada yada yada, or something like that. Such a page would also be excellent for the infamous "I can't get the Mycons to go to Organon" problem as well as contain the hints from the RPRG. Additionally, the hints can be hidden like a UHS using [[Hints/hint1]] to contain the hints so that a lazy person who only wants specific information won't accidentally see information that his lazy eyes don't want to see. A blurb can then be included on the non-spoiler hints page directing people to the '''Hints''', of course with a slight warning. Imho, this is a much eleganter solution than putting the verbose and overly complicated warnings and the annoying extra spaces and markings used right now, which are more appropriate to forum threads and not wiki articles. --[[User:Fyzixfighter\|Fyzixfighter]] 16:28, 19 March 2007 (CET)

			Well then, proceed with the deletion. [[User:86.35.40.204\|86.35.40.204]] 17:47, 19 March 2007 (CET)

Fyzixfighter: reply and proposed compromise

2007-03-19T15:28:10Z

reply and proposed compromise

← Older revision		Revision as of 15:28, 19 March 2007
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	:::But this page is made for the average/lazy player who doesn't want to map so many portals himself, so it DOES NOT spoil his game. He knows what he wants. I think that we should simply add some lines in this article about what it is about, more clearly, before the table. Let me show you...		:::But this page is made for the average/lazy player who doesn't want to map so many portals himself, so it DOES NOT spoil his game. He knows what he wants. I think that we should simply add some lines in this article about what it is about, more clearly, before the table. Let me show you...
	And no, if you move the article to the spoiler section, the same lazy player (not wanting to spoil his game - once again, HE WANTS to spoil only his enjoyment of manually mapping the portals, since he doesn't feel the joy in this activity) would NOT look at it.		:::And no, if you move the article to the spoiler section, the same lazy player (not wanting to spoil his game - once again, HE WANTS to spoil only his enjoyment of manually mapping the portals, since he doesn't feel the joy in this activity) would NOT look at it.
	Plus, there will be no danger for completely-non-spoiler players, since the link is named "Read only if you have a green background" and even if they will click it, it will first lead to another page - you will see. [[User:86.35.40.204\|86.35.40.204]] 14:44, 19 March 2007 (CET)		:::Plus, there will be no danger for completely-non-spoiler players, since the link is named "Read only if you have a green background" and even if they will click it, it will first lead to another page - you will see. [[User:86.35.40.204\|86.35.40.204]] 14:44, 19 March 2007 (CET)

			::::In my view, the non-Spoiler hints page isn't for lazy players, but for first-time players. I have little to no respect for lazy people, and I hate having to compromise to satisfy the lowest common denominator. It's like putting "Warning: Hot" on coffee you buy at McDonald's or microwave instructions for pop-tarts that are longer than one step. Laziness should not be encouraged. I mean, how hard is it to get a piece of paper and pencil and write down 16 numbers. However, imho, the best compromise so far that still allows this information to be accessed while maintaining the integrity of the Non-Spoiler Hints page is a [[Hints]] page, with a disclaimer at the top that warns people that the information here spoils some aspects of the gameplay without spoiling major plot points, yada yada yada yada, or something like that. Such a page would also be excellent for the infamous "I can't get the Mycons to go to Organon" problem as well as contain the hints from the RPRG. Additionally, the hints can be hidden like a UHS using [[Hints/hint1]] to contain the hints so that a lazy person who only wants specific information won't accidentally see information that his lazy eyes don't want to see. A blurb can then be included on the non-spoiler hints page directing people to the '''Hints''', of course with a slight warning. Imho, this is a much eleganter solution than putting the verbose and overly complicated warnings and the annoying extra spaces and markings used right now, which are more appropriate to forum threads and not wiki articles. --[[User:Fyzixfighter\|Fyzixfighter]] 16:28, 19 March 2007 (CET)

86.35.40.204 at 13:44, 19 March 2007

2007-03-19T13:44:55Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:44, 19 March 2007
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	::Simply putting the "read this only if you have a green background" doesn't remove the spoiler-ish nature since the list is revealing information that a first time player won't have. As I assume this is the result of a thread over on the UQM forum, and if you really still want something like this in, I would suggest adjusting [[Walkthrough#Portal Destinations]], reducing it to a list of just HS and QS coordinates, adding a wikilink to [[QuasiSpace#QuasiSpace Portals]] in that section of the walkthrough, and directing people to that section of the walkthrough (and then we can delete this page). But again, any list of this nature '''spoils''' the excitement of entering a portal without knowing the final destination, and so should not be linked to from the Non-Spoiler hints page. The creation of this type of page gets into the gray area better handled by a UHS. Aside from creating a '''Spoiler Hints''' article and clearly describing what is and isn't revealed, I don't see a reason for keeping this article. I also think making this a subpage of the QuasiSpace or Walkthrough would be more appropriate (rather than editting the Walkthrough list), allowing the information to be kept, but not in an actual article. --[[User:Fyzixfighter\|Fyzixfighter]] 23:50, 18 March 2007 (CET)		::Simply putting the "read this only if you have a green background" doesn't remove the spoiler-ish nature since the list is revealing information that a first time player won't have. As I assume this is the result of a thread over on the UQM forum, and if you really still want something like this in, I would suggest adjusting [[Walkthrough#Portal Destinations]], reducing it to a list of just HS and QS coordinates, adding a wikilink to [[QuasiSpace#QuasiSpace Portals]] in that section of the walkthrough, and directing people to that section of the walkthrough (and then we can delete this page). But again, any list of this nature '''spoils''' the excitement of entering a portal without knowing the final destination, and so should not be linked to from the Non-Spoiler hints page. The creation of this type of page gets into the gray area better handled by a UHS. Aside from creating a '''Spoiler Hints''' article and clearly describing what is and isn't revealed, I don't see a reason for keeping this article. I also think making this a subpage of the QuasiSpace or Walkthrough would be more appropriate (rather than editting the Walkthrough list), allowing the information to be kept, but not in an actual article. --[[User:Fyzixfighter\|Fyzixfighter]] 23:50, 18 March 2007 (CET)

			:::But this page is made for the average/lazy player who doesn't want to map so many portals himself, so it DOES NOT spoil his game. He knows what he wants. I think that we should simply add some lines in this article about what it is about, more clearly, before the table. Let me show you...
			And no, if you move the article to the spoiler section, the same lazy player (not wanting to spoil his game - once again, HE WANTS to spoil only his enjoyment of manually mapping the portals, since he doesn't feel the joy in this activity) would NOT look at it.
			Plus, there will be no danger for completely-non-spoiler players, since the link is named "Read only if you have a green background" and even if they will click it, it will first lead to another page - you will see. [[User:86.35.40.204\|86.35.40.204]] 14:44, 19 March 2007 (CET)

Fyzixfighter: another two cents

2007-03-18T22:50:58Z

another two cents

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:50, 18 March 2007
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	Simple: at "Non-spoiler hints" I have added a link to this page under "Read this only if you have a green background". [[User:86.35.40.204\|86.35.40.204]] 19:43, 18 March 2007 (CET)		Simple: at "Non-spoiler hints" I have added a link to this page under "Read this only if you have a green background". [[User:86.35.40.204\|86.35.40.204]] 19:43, 18 March 2007 (CET)

			::Simply putting the "read this only if you have a green background" doesn't remove the spoiler-ish nature since the list is revealing information that a first time player won't have. As I assume this is the result of a thread over on the UQM forum, and if you really still want something like this in, I would suggest adjusting [[Walkthrough#Portal Destinations]], reducing it to a list of just HS and QS coordinates, adding a wikilink to [[QuasiSpace#QuasiSpace Portals]] in that section of the walkthrough, and directing people to that section of the walkthrough (and then we can delete this page). But again, any list of this nature '''spoils''' the excitement of entering a portal without knowing the final destination, and so should not be linked to from the Non-Spoiler hints page. The creation of this type of page gets into the gray area better handled by a UHS. Aside from creating a '''Spoiler Hints''' article and clearly describing what is and isn't revealed, I don't see a reason for keeping this article. I also think making this a subpage of the QuasiSpace or Walkthrough would be more appropriate (rather than editting the Walkthrough list), allowing the information to be kept, but not in an actual article. --[[User:Fyzixfighter\|Fyzixfighter]] 23:50, 18 March 2007 (CET)

86.35.40.204 at 18:43, 18 March 2007

2007-03-18T18:43:10Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 18:43, 18 March 2007
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	:Well, then give a solution to the problem; how would you direct those players to this page without providing spoilers to those who don't want to be spoiled about the existence of QuasiSpace, while providing enough information in the link on what the link target is about to those who do want to know? — [[User:Svdb\|SvdB]] 18:03, 18 March 2007 (CET)		:Well, then give a solution to the problem; how would you direct those players to this page without providing spoilers to those who don't want to be spoiled about the existence of QuasiSpace, while providing enough information in the link on what the link target is about to those who do want to know? — [[User:Svdb\|SvdB]] 18:03, 18 March 2007 (CET)

			Simple: at "Non-spoiler hints" I have added a link to this page under "Read this only if you have a green background". [[User:86.35.40.204\|86.35.40.204]] 19:43, 18 March 2007 (CET)

Svdb: reply

2007-03-18T17:03:42Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:03, 18 March 2007
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	Some players may want to know this - if they are too lazy to note down on paper the correspondences and they don't want to spoil their game by using a table that includes alien races and special planets. [[User:86.35.40.204\|86.35.40.204]] 17:03, 18 March 2007 (CET)		Some players may want to know this - if they are too lazy to note down on paper the correspondences and they don't want to spoil their game by using a table that includes alien races and special planets. [[User:86.35.40.204\|86.35.40.204]] 17:03, 18 March 2007 (CET)

			:Well, then give a solution to the problem; how would you direct those players to this page without providing spoilers to those who don't want to be spoiled about the existence of QuasiSpace, while providing enough information in the link on what the link target is about to those who do want to know? — [[User:Svdb\|SvdB]] 18:03, 18 March 2007 (CET)